Welcome!
Pathfinder is a fair suggestion, but, alternatively, you could look into the superior version of D&D…
[quote=“Simon”]Welcome!
Pathfinder is a fair suggestion, but, alternatively, you could look into the superior version of D&D…
:p[/quote]
5th edition masterrace
jk - welcome to the forum ! 
It tries to solve some issues, but still has the mathematical problems of 3.X
(Good Saves : Bad Saves rise not parallel, etc.; Linear Fighter - Quadratic Wizards, etc.)
Has great artwork, that gives you the “I want to play that” feel, though.
I want to play a mighty warrior … whose sword weighs so much that I can barely keep it from falling over, much less swing!
Well there is a difference between the artwork that is used for book covers and the like, and the actual game mechanics.
More than the artwork, if pathfinder solves the problem of linear fighter vs quadratic wizards, that sounds very attracting!!!
D&D 5th edition… mmmmm… I played 4th edition and it was pretty disappointing. So not sure I actually want to read the fifth… Moreover, more rules is not something I appreciate. I am too lazy to read them! Lol
But honestly, the worse it is when u have a lot of rules and a little lawyer as a player… that really slows down the game.
[quote=“Kas”][quote=“Darthbinks”]
It tries to solve some issues, but still has the mathematical problems of 3.X
(Good Saves : Bad Saves rise not parallel, etc.; Linear Fighter - Quadratic Wizards, etc.)
[/quote]
More than the artwork, if pathfinder solves the problem of linear fighter vs quadratic wizards[/quote]
nope it doesn’t; sadly 
[quote=“Darthbinks”]
but still has the mathematical problems of 3.X
(Good Saves : Bad Saves rise not parallel, etc.; Linear Fighter - Quadratic Wizards, etc.)[/quote]
although PF warriors can deal so much damage, that every caster (except some overspecialised blaster evocers) gets a inferioriy complex, PF casters still rule (especially in high levels) thanks to their flexibility (and other problems D&D 3.X has).
some things PF fixes:[ul]
[li]Prestige Classes are no longer a must[/li]
[li]you can level your character in your class from level 1-20 in the same class & it (kinda) works[/li]
[li]some changes to some spells (divine favour & divine power don’t stack anymore; no save-or-die spells except those that allow two saves like phantasmal killer/wierd)[/li]
[li]especially the polymorph transmutation spells as well as the Druid’s Wildshape ability were greatly debuffed[/li]
[li]you can play a decent warrior without taking a monster&/template (casters are still overpowered though)[/li][/ul]
I don’t think this is a caster vs. warrior thing. It really depends on the class(es), archetypes, feats, etc… you pick.
Which is one of the reasons why I like the system. You have so many choices and they can really make a big difference.
4th Edition fixed that, but the “problem” resurfaces in 5th.
[quote=“Kas”]D&D 5th edition… mmmmm… I played 4th edition and it was pretty disappointing. So not sure I actually want to read the fifth… Moreover, more rules is not something I appreciate. I am too lazy to read them! Lol
But honestly, the worse it is when u have a lot of rules and a little lawyer as a player… that really slows down the game.[/quote]
doesn’t have D&D3.X ton’s of ton’s of rules?
PF is basically the same; but you have the problem, that some spells worked only slightly differently in 3.5, and when you just skim it while looking it up, you don’t notice it.
D&D 5th is relatively rules-light compared to that (yet)
I think he means that he already knows 3.5 and doesn’t really want to read a lot more rules of another game just to be able to play it.
With Pathfinder that’s not a problem at all. If you know 3.5 and you got a guy in the group who’s already played Pathfinder before, he can point out the differences and you’ll be fine.
I am not talking about pure damage output.
I am talking about flexibility.
Rescue the princess from the evil king:
What can a fighter do:[ul]
[li]Intimidate the evil king[/li]
[li]Full Attack[/li]
[li]Make a cool Combat Manuever like Grapple[/li][/ul]
What can a wizard do:[ul]
[li]make himself invisible; go there & make princess invisible too; go home[/li]
[li]call mighty planar allies for help; each has the combat ability of the party-fighter[/li]
[li]dominate the evil king[/li]
[li]speak, shape and walk through stone to get to the princess & leave no trace[/li]
[li]travel via a parallel dimension (like plane of shadow or ethereal plane) to the princess; take princess with you; travel back[/li]
[li]scry + charm the local orc warlord; use his army against the evil king; make the whole orc army stronger, faster & tougher; polymoph the orc warlord into a giant to make him even stronger;[/li]
[li]use confusion while being invisible to make the troops of the evil king slaughter themselves; magically conjure popcorn & enjoy the show[/li]
[li]read the thoughts of the evil king while scrying on him; read the thoughts of his court to find allies, who want to conspire against the evil king; tell them his secrets for getting their aid[/li]
[li]scry the king and summon a succubus; teleport succubus into the king’s bedchamber to “distract” the king to death[/li]
[li]polymorph into the evil king and polymorp the evil king into an oyster; magically conjure a bottle of white wine; dine[/li]
[li]use his self-crafted wand of fireballs to decimate the troops of the evil king, while being invisible and flying in the air as well as being protected against ranged attacks[/li]
[li]possess the evil king while trapping his soul in a gem[/li]
[li]create an undead squad, who have regeneration and reasemble themselves if defeated and win against the soldiers of the evil king in a battle of attrition; slaughter those to get more regenerating undead[/li]
[li]scry the princess + teleport to the princess; teleport home with the princess[/li]
[li]a.s.o.[/li][/ul]
[quote=“Darthbinks”]
[/quote]
Remind me again which one is the parody?
Actually that is rather a question of creativity than just class-abilities.
Depending on the fighter he can do quite a lot:
Infiltrate the evil king’s castle and take out the guards on the way. And then the king.
Sniper the guards from the castle walls. Then go in.
Set a part of the castle or another building that is close on fire to create a diversion to go in undetected.
Intimidate some weak guards/peasants so that they serve him (in whatever way) instead of the evil king.
Kill a guard, take his stuff and pretend to be one of them to get in the castle.
Get a cart load some oil barrels onto it and roll it against the castles gate/leave it there and shoot a fire-arrow at it to take out the ones who wanna drag it away.
And lot of other things that include fire.
etc…
BTW: All the magic stuff is nice but if you play with the right GM he’s got some guys set on detecting magic or even ward against it.
She has a kinda nice background story though (the sword belonged to a giant, and she can only use it in barbarian rage).
Although I am not 100% happy with the PF rules, I like the Paizo (PF company) artwork
btw. transgender dwarven shaman:
[quote=“Thopthes”]Actually that is rather a question of creativity than just class-abilities.
Depending on the fighter he can do quite a lot:
etc…[/quote]
All those things a wizard can do as well; and when he casts spells like (tenser’s) transformation and buff spells, he can even hit better than the fighter, be invisibile, see in darkness, and be protected by magical shadows that conceal him, as well has having a high amount of skill points, thanks to his high Intelligence score.
A Fighter with no Hide & Sneak class-skills plus armor check penalty as well as no other social class skills except Intimidate - his options will quite limited in comparison; especially to the multitude of options a full caster has at his disposal.
True, but still the caster wins in flexibility and in options.
In PF a fighter can at least “shine”. In D&D 3.0/5 a monk was typically weaker than the animal companion of the druid.
[quote="-H-"]
Remind me again which one is the parody?[/quote]
How many animes or video games have you seen/played?
I’m not a real fan of the oversized swords either but I also think it to be pointless to focus your critique on a picture of one of the classes - especially since this has nothing to do with the game itself.
If you take a look at the carrying capacity table to find out what an 18 or a 20 in STR means you’ll get why
[quote="-H-"]
I want to play a mighty warrior … whose sword weighs so much that I can barely keep it from falling over, much less swing![/quote]
is kinda beside the point.
If you’d focus your argument on certain mechanics of the game I might understand your point but in this case I can only say that afaik the rules don’t rely on depictions of classes.
Sounds like damning with faint praise. 
That may be an extreme example, but there do seem to be a lot of strangely-proportioned people with sword blades wider than their faces. Every time I see a Pathfinder pic, I can’t help thinking, “These guys had Citadel figures when they were kids!”
[quote=“Thopthes”]I’m not a real fan of the oversized swords either but I also think it to be pointless to focus your critique on a picture of one of the classes - especially since this has nothing to do with the game itself.
If you take a look at the carrying capacity table to find out what an 18 or a 20 in STR means you’ll get why
[quote="-H-"]
I want to play a mighty warrior … whose sword weighs so much that I can barely keep it from falling over, much less swing![/quote]
is kinda beside the point.
If you’d focus your argument on certain mechanics of the game I might understand your point but in this case I can only say that afaik the rules don’t rely on depictions of classes.[/quote]
Say what? I was replying specifically to Darth’s comment about the illustrations. This has nothing whatsoever to do with mechanics or rules. It’s not a critique of the game as a whole, either, although maybe that goes against the spirit of edition wars.
Sounds like damning with faint praise.
That may be an extreme example, but there do seem to be a lot of strangely-proportioned people with sword blades wider than their faces. Every time I see a Pathfinder pic, I can’t help thinking, “These guys had Citadel figures when they were kids!”[/quote]
maybe they had
who knows
In my opinion Paizo (in PF as well in their Dragon/Dungeon magazine times) provided great inspiring artwork for the D&D/PF ruleset.
b.t.w. my favorite rpg artwork is from Legend of of the Five Rings, especially their 4th Edition material (they have the advantage, that they can use the pictures of their trading card game); but to each his own.